User talk:Angelonkichoi

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Welcome to Wikimedia Commons, Angelonkichoi!
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-- Wikimedia Commons Welcome (talk) 14:35, 9 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

File:LDRCM.2013.1.jpg[edit]

File:LDRCM.2013.1.jpg has been listed at Commons:Deletion requests so that the community can discuss whether it should be kept or not. We would appreciate it if you could go to voice your opinion about this at its entry.

If you created this file, please note that the fact that it has been proposed for deletion does not necessarily mean that we do not value your kind contribution. It simply means that one person believes that there is some specific problem with it, such as a copyright issue. Please see Commons:But it's my own work! for a guide on how to address these issues.

Please remember to respond to and – if appropriate – contradict the arguments supporting deletion. Arguments which focus on the nominator will not affect the result of the nomination. Thank you!
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RichardEMartin (talk) 08:12, 21 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Notification about possible deletion[edit]

Some contents have been listed at Commons:Deletion requests so that the community can discuss whether they should be kept or not. We would appreciate it if you could go to voice your opinion about this at their entry.

If you created these pages, please note that the fact that they have been proposed for deletion does not necessarily mean that we do not value your kind contribution. It simply means that one person believes that there is some specific problem with them, such as a copyright issue. Please see Commons:But it's my own work! for a guide on how to address these issues.

Please remember to respond to and – if appropriate – contradict the arguments supporting deletion. Arguments which focus on the nominator will not affect the result of the nomination. Thank you!
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Affected:


And also:
* File:RCM0001A.jpg

Yours sincerely, Angelonkichoi (talk) 10:55, 26 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Please reupload[edit]

Angelonkichoi, I just fixed all your speedy-delete requests, something did not work right and they all look did not show. This is great set of images, so please make sure to reupload. Can I help you with the upload? Especially how to use Commons templates? Also before the upload can you look at wikidata items related to those images they all link to the museum but the link is dead. The best thing to do would be to start with a single image, I can fix up the template use and than plan a big upload. --Jarekt (talk) 02:37, 28 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]


Hi Jarekt thanks a lot for your help indeed! Sorry I am afraid I don't understand a few places of your message, could you explain please: "they all look did not show" - what do you mean?
And regarding "Also before the upload can you look at wikidata items related to those images they all link to the museum but the link is dead" - before noticing your message, I reuploaded a few images and they seem to be fine and have linked to the wikidata. For example see https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:RCM0001_2012-12-03_CaseOpen_Preview.a.jpg . On the title of the summary box, the hyperlink of clavicytherium has successfully linked to Q89189753. Or do you notice any problem with the template?
The previous batch needs to be deleted because the csv file has a problem with aligning the image and their names, which is not wikicommons' problem. Now the csv is fixed, I hope the reuploading can work, thank you. --Angelonkichoi (talk) 14:17, 28 April 2020 (UTC)(talk)[reply]
I also do not know what "they all look did not show" means, what I was trying to say is that your wikicode to add speedy-delete requests did not produced a valid template. I did not analyze it too closely but probably some parenthesis were off. There are multiple issues with File:RCM0001 2012-12-03 CaseOpen Preview.a.jpg so lets pause the reupload until they can be fixed. There are several issues:
If you have any questions about my comments please ask. I will be happy to go into more details. And I love the photographs, you were uploading. --Jarekt (talk) 15:50, 28 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Hi Jarekt, many thanks for your detailed answer and help. Glad you like the images. I have questions and appreciate your help: 1. I am using Pattypan.jar to do the batch upload. It generates an excel template with different columns to fill in and to be uploaded in this way. I noticed you edited on my file RCM0001 2012-12-03 CaseOpen Preview.a.jpg, namely: i) created subheadings "object" and photograph", ii) added a reference (Royal College of Music) in the field “Accession number”, iii) added a public domain label in the field “Object> Permission”, iv) added two categories - how can I do this in excel? For iv), I imagine I need to create two columns of "category" if I want the object to be listed under two categories - is this correct? --Angelonkichoi (talk) 10:29, 29 April 2020 (UTC)Angelonkichoi[reply]

Angelonkichoi, I have not used Pattypan before so I am not sure how to work with it, other than what is explained at Commons:Pattypan/Simple_manual. It seems like Pattypan supports {{Artwork}} template but possibly not the {{Art photo}} template (separating the data into object & photographer sections), so I changed File:RCM0001 2012-12-03 CaseOpen Preview.a.jpg to just use {{Artwork}} template. So during the upload just fill: Wikidata, Description, source (with URL), license (with {{CC-BY-4.0}}) and category fields (separated by semicolon (;)). All the information about the actual objects should go to Wikidata, uploaded using d:help:QuickStatements. {{Artwork}} template can find it there and use it to properly fill all the fields for you. I can help with that process. Do you have a stable URLs for your photographs or do we need to use OTRS (see com:otrs) to validate the license? Once you are ready upload a single file to see if it works. --Jarekt (talk) 13:57, 29 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Hi Jarekt, thanks for offering help! I have updated the excel file now, do you think you could review it to see if there is any problem? https://drive.google.com/open?id=1SmcgB9BeKDg8Usx-Mfzv-BCETrFThukK. Apart from that, I have a few questions: i) There is a “File usage on Commons” part at the bottom of the page (https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:RCM0001_2012-12-03_CaseOpen_Preview.a.jpg), and a file (User:OgreBot/Notable uploads/2020 April 28) apart from the original image is automatically added, but cannot be opened. Is there a way to delete it? ii) How to add a reference (Royal College of Music) in the cell “Accession number” of the excel? iii) Re the captions - do they need to be added in a separate process using the QuickStatements? If they can go in this sreadsheet. even better. The text in each title field from Adlib would work nicely for the captions. Thank you.

Angelonkichoi, I looked at http://museumcollections.rcm.ac.uk/terms-of-use/ and there is a problem. In our Commons:Licensing#Acceptable_licenses we do have a policy: "The following restrictions must not apply to the image or other media file: [] Noncommercial/Educational use only." while the above license states that images are for "for non-commercial, educational, and research purposes". So any work we spend on upload is likely to be wasted since the images will most likely be deleted. I do not know if it is possible to change this restriction, but with it the upload should not happen. Please ask for second opinion at Commons:Village_pump/Copyright. --Jarekt (talk) 14:11, 30 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Hi Jarekt, just to add my grateful thanks for the help you have provided. I am the digital manager at the Royal College of Music Museum and have been looking into the comments above. We would certainly like to facilitate wider access to the images being provided. May I check, if we adjust our terms of use (http://museumcollections.rcm.ac.uk/terms-of-use/) to CC Attribution-ShareAlike 4.0 International (CC BY-SA 4.0, https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/), thereby allowing commercial adaptation of these versions, would this be OK? — Preceding unsigned comment added by RichardEMartin (talk • contribs) 08:27, 4 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Hi Jarekt thanks for your heads up. Further to my manager's message, I have posted on the https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:Village_pump#Copyright and got replied CC BY-SA 4.0 is okay. Could you please help have a look at our latest excel file please and confirm it is all good to go? https://drive.google.com/open?id=1ntafe5k504DDA7I79x8GAFxNnQNvF9aS Also it would be much appreciated if you could let me know your views please on my previous questions i to iii in my last message above. Thank you again. --Angelonkichoi (talk) 11:50, 6 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@RichardEMartin and Angelonkichoi: a straight CC-BY-SA 4.0 without any other restrictions or conditions would be perfectly suitable. Other change http://museumcollections.rcm.ac.uk/terms-of-use/, which is not required but might be helpful is simplifying your 6 bullet attribution requirements. The usual attribution we see is photographer or institution and License. If more complicated attribution is needed than we should add it via {{Credit line}} template or spell out for each file exactly what is needed. As for upload, it is kind of a long story but we are in a middle of a big shift of what are best practices for such uploads. In the old days, all the metadata was added through wikitext code added to each file and Pattypan is capable of doing just that. The problem is that it is a lot of work to get all the wikitext code just right for the data is properly translated to other languages if viewed by people who do not speak English. A new way of doing things is to upload all the object metadata to Wikidata and for files to pull it from there. See for example File:RCM0001 2012-12-03 CaseOpen Preview.a.jpg and the file only has the following fields:
  • "description" field with long text description
  • "wikidata" field telling the file where to find all the metadata.
  • "photographer" clarifying who is the author of the photograph. I added "Employee of Royal College of Music" but it might be nice to give credit to the actual people. Your call.
  • "source" this link I think should be to a object specific page where one can find the image, the metadata about the object and where CC-BY-SA 4.0 would be mentioned. That might be http://museumcollections.rcm.ac.uk/collection/Details/collect/1062 (URL used as a reference on Wikidata) but that page at the moment does not have any information and is in fact identical to a page for any made up number like here. Richard this might be a question for you: are there plans to make those URLs show object specific content? Another possibility is to create a template like Template:BArch-cooperation or Template:Nationaal Archief. See Category:GLAM templates.
The file and the google spreadsheet should not need other fields. Adding more fields, like "dimensions" is actual bad because your English-only text is blocking which would be internationalized to be pulled from Wikidata.
Sorry I am a bit long winded, but there is a lot to cover, so can I propose the following steps:
  1. Richard can you have text of http://museumcollections.rcm.ac.uk/terms-of-use/ changed? As we should not proceed with image upload beforehand.
  2. All the object metadata should be added to the Wikidata items. Richard did a lot of that already, but inception and size should be added. I would use d:Help:QuickStatements tool. I can do it but would prefer to just help. Use this query to check the results. Verify that there is a 1:1 relation betweem inventory numbers and Wikidata item IDs (q-codes). Create new items if missing.
  3. get a single image to look just the way you want it and with a link or links to your website. Ideally we should be able to access image, meatadata and terms of use, but at the minimum terms of use
  4. upload couple images using upload tool and try to mimic the first image
  5. only then mass upload all the images.
If you are interested it might be faster to communicate through a zoom meeting or a call. --Jarekt (talk) 14:35, 6 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]


I compared your https://drive.google.com/open?id=1ntafe5k504DDA7I79x8GAFxNnQNvF9aS with the values already uploaded to Wikidata. I was only looking at item id (QID) and inventory number (INV) and there are some discrepancies. Some might be issues with you spreadsheet and some might be with wikidata, but this need to be unified first

  1. the following INVs without QIDs, should have one:
  1. RCM0001 should be linked to Clavicytherium (Q61324520)
  2. The following INVS link to QIDs which have a different INV, while the INV not used by any other QID
  1. The following INVS link to QIDs which have a different INV, while the INV used by any other QID

Can you reconcile those. --Jarekt (talk) 04:21, 7 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

File tagging File:LDRCM.2013.1.a.jpg[edit]

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JuTa 16:48, 16 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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