Template talk:De facto boundaries/i18n
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What exactly are we disclaiming and why?[edit]
(@Seryo93: This relates to recent edits you and I made to this template.)
This is what it currently says (I only include the relevant part): "The boundaries on this map ... do not imply any endorsement or acceptance."
What exactly is being disclaimed here and why? First of all, who is the subject here that doesn't "endorse or accepts"? Second, if the purpose is to avoid someone mistakenly claiming NPOV violation (whereas the Commons doesn't have any such policy), then shouldn't this be explicitly stated instead of vaguely claiming some lack of endorsement by who-knows-whom? Cherkash (talk) 19:39, 10 April 2021 (UTC)
- Well, if you read a thread that prompted me to reinsert that disclaimer, then it would be obvious: the misunderstanding arising from lack of disclaimer is apparent Wikipedia's "endorsement" of this or that border. Which leads to deletion attempts even when the template is inserted (File:Major_Russian_Gas_Pipelines_to_Europe_ru_defacto_borders.svg). Bests, --Seryo93 (talk) 20:07, 10 April 2021 (UTC)
- @Seryo93: I did read that discussion before starting this thread. Yes, there is perennial confusion between the Commons and various Wikipedias (note, it’s not a single Wikipedia - since Wikipedias in different languages have different rules). That’s why I strongly suggest clarifying whose endorsement or acceptance is meant here, otherwise it doesn’t clear this possible confusion. Cherkash (talk) 09:00, 13 April 2021 (UTC)
- OK, I would suggest adding "by Wikimedia Commons" then (and probably also add something along COM:NPOV lines: "do not imply any endorsement or acceptance by Wikimedia Commons, since it is not its role to adjudicate on subject-matter disputes nor to force local projects to use one version of a file in preference to another", or similar). Since Wikipedias indeed may choose which map they prefer (that's why we have COM:NPOV: we don't dictate particular mapping will to all sister projects but let them choose). Some opted to paint Crimea as Russian on maps of Russia (de facto borders), some as Ukrainian (internationally recognized borders), and others (enwiki and ruwiki including) as disputed area. Bests, --Seryo93 (talk) 09:04, 13 April 2021 (UTC)
- I'm going to add something like "This is just one of the different views on the subject matter (see COM:NPOV)." This sounds more neutral and right to the point of the COM:NPOV policy. Cherkash (talk) 16:58, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
- OK, I would suggest adding "by Wikimedia Commons" then (and probably also add something along COM:NPOV lines: "do not imply any endorsement or acceptance by Wikimedia Commons, since it is not its role to adjudicate on subject-matter disputes nor to force local projects to use one version of a file in preference to another", or similar). Since Wikipedias indeed may choose which map they prefer (that's why we have COM:NPOV: we don't dictate particular mapping will to all sister projects but let them choose). Some opted to paint Crimea as Russian on maps of Russia (de facto borders), some as Ukrainian (internationally recognized borders), and others (enwiki and ruwiki including) as disputed area. Bests, --Seryo93 (talk) 09:04, 13 April 2021 (UTC)
- @Seryo93: I did read that discussion before starting this thread. Yes, there is perennial confusion between the Commons and various Wikipedias (note, it’s not a single Wikipedia - since Wikipedias in different languages have different rules). That’s why I strongly suggest clarifying whose endorsement or acceptance is meant here, otherwise it doesn’t clear this possible confusion. Cherkash (talk) 09:00, 13 April 2021 (UTC)