File talk:World laws pertaining to homosexual relationships and expression.svg

From Wikimedia Commons, the free media repository
Jump to navigation Jump to search

1, 2, 3

Estonia[edit]

We need to change the color to dark purple, like Nepal because the same-sex marriage starts from 1 Januari 2024. -GogoLion (talk) 15:11, 20 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]

thats true. In Estonia same-sex marriage is allowed from 1 January 2024. --92.76.103.149 20
01, 7 December 2023 (UTC)

Punjab[edit]

According to Equaldex, homosexuality is "legal in Punjab", therefore shouldn't Punjab in this map be gray, and not yellow? GeometryCrown (talk) 02:03, 8 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

That entry with the text was marked as "historical". I think homosexuality had been continuously banned nationwide since 1860, as a result of British colonial law. --Minoa (talk) 08:20, 13 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]
DON'T USE EQUALDEX AS REFERENCE! IT CAN BE EDITED BY ANYONE, SAME AS WIKIPEDIA. -GogoLion (talk) 14:15, 17 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Chechnya[edit]

Although homosexuals are often killed in Chechnya, including allegedly by prison authorities, these are extrajudicial killings. There is no de jure death penalty for homosexuality in Chechnya, nor is there really a de facto death penalty, as although detention and torture are common, the authorities typically leave the actual killing to families and vigilantes. If we considered every case of homosexuals being killed in prison as that country having a death penalty, I think this map would look very different. I do think the orange status "Arrests, detention, imprisonment or de-facto illegal" would be appropriate for Chechnya, however. Also, it should probably be striped with gold since LGBT expression is actually illegal there. Nosferattus (talk) 18:37, 3 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I might need a second opinion on that, but it seems Chechnya has a unique way of repressing the LGBT community in a way that the country may have to remain burgundy or beige-burgundy striped. --Minoa (talk) 22:12, 12 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Papua New Guinea[edit]

In this ILGA-Report there is a mention of an arrest of two men made on 18 november 2022 for having sex. They were released on bail and were due to appear in court on 27 march 2023 but no new information about this seems to have been acquired since. Does this not mean that Papua New Guinea should be coloured orange instead of yellow? https://ilga.org/severe-spikes-arrests-prosecutions-lgbt-gender-diverse-people-2023 Kugelfisch002 (talk) 14:03, 12 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Arrests are sufficient for orange status. --Minoa (talk) 22:09, 12 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Qatar[edit]

Should Qatar be coloured dark orange (death penalty not enforced), since under sharia law muslim men who engage in homosexual sex can de jure be punished with death? Kugelfisch002 (talk) 20:20, 14 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

That has been updated. --Minoa (talk) 02:10, 15 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Eritrea, Brunei[edit]

Yellow according to ILGA report that we used to change PNG, should we change those too? Kaleetan (talk) 20:58, 16 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

The Yellow is used for countries in which the laws against same-sex sexual relations haven't been enforced in the last five years. Although the report presents no examples for enforcement in Eritrea and Brunei after 2013 and 2016 respectively, it makes it clear that this does not mean there is none.
For Brunei it says: "This dearth of information should not
be taken to represent a lack of enforcement, but rather as a
demonstration of the urgent need for further research."
In Eritrea the law against homosexual activity was made harsher in 2015 and the report mentions "the difficulty in
accessing verifiable data on criminal enforcement".
Kugelfisch002 (talk) 00:13, 28 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Artsakh[edit]

Although the announced dissolution of the Republic of Artsakh seems to not have taken place officially, the grey dot in the map should be removed and treated as part of Azerbaijan, because the territory is no longer controlled by Artsakh. Kugelfisch002 (talk) 14:27, 25 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

That request has been taken care of. --Minoa (talk) 23:05, 25 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Comoros, Maldives, Sri Lanka[edit]

The Ilga report mentions one case of enforcement of laws against homosexual activity in the Comoros ([1]) and multiple cases for both the Maldives and Sri Lanka ([2], [3]) in the past five years. These countries should therefore be changed from yellow to orange. Kugelfisch002 (talk) 21:03, 28 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I have acted on Comoros and Sri Lanka, but none of the sources mention Maldives. --Minoa (talk) 07:27, 9 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The Ilga report [4] mentions multiple cases of enforcement against homosexual sexual acts in the Maldives in 2022, but doesn't state the sources. Instead it says:
"This source contains personal names or images and has thus been redacted to protect the safety of those involved. If you require access to this source for corroboration or for
COI Research purposes, please reach out to research@ilga.org." I don't know if Ilga is accepted as a reliable source for Wikipedia and if therefore it would be enough to just cite the report.
Thank you for doing all these edits.
Kugelfisch002 (talk) 12:29, 10 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I just wanted to add a few comments:
The IGLA report mentiones that Bangladesh, Pakistan and Sri Lanka all have laws on the books that provide jail time for homosexuality. However for Sri Lanka (and possibly Bangladesh) it does not state that people have been jailed in the past three years, just detained and interviewed by the police.
In the cast of Pakistan, the is a lot of evidence (as provided below) that there is a death penality on the books, and that areas that are under Sharia Law or religious influence can still enforce homophobia and transphobia.
Pakistan should be changed to red, and Bangladesh should be changed to orange, and Sri Lanka changed to yellow or orange.
Shironese (talk) 15:42, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
This is incorrect.
Indo-SL lesbian couple seeking matrimony released | The Morning
The woman was only ordered to go to psychriatic evaluation for suicidal tendencies. SamanthaWinning (talk) 03:35, 7 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Yemen[edit]

Recently, 13 people were sentenced to death for homosexuality by Houthi courts ([5], [6]) so the area controlled by the Houthi movement should be striped dark brown (death under militias). Yemen as a whole should be light brown for death not enforced ([7], [8]). Kugelfisch002 (talk) 12:32, 10 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Done, along w Maldives.
No regular marriage in Nepal, so just a ring. Kwamikagami (talk) 18:41, 10 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Greece[edit]

On 15 February 2024 Hellenic parliament allowed same-sex marriage in Greece.

The country should be marked in dark-blue colour. 92.76.96.107 22:22, 15 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Nepal[edit]

Recently (I don’t remember when) Nepal legalized same-sex marriage. Alex Mitchell of The Goodies (talk) 15:14, 24 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Namibia[edit]

While Namibia is depicted on the map, it is not marked with a key. OMGShay 92 (talk) 11:13, 2 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Namibia is striped with yellow for unenforced prison and light purple for limited foreign recognition, as both of these are true in Namibia. Kaleetan (talk) 21:51, 1 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Kyrgyzstan[edit]

According to this source, the Kyrgyz law is vaguely worded and does not explicitly mention LGBT. The source also includes interviews with local LGBT activists who stated that the law has not yet been enforced against LGBT people. Some countries like Bahrain and Jordan also have similar vaguely worded laws. Both Bahrain and Jordan are marked in gray, even though their vaguely worded laws are being enforced against LGBT people. So should we change Kyrgyzstan back to gray color until we have solid evidence that the law is being enforced against LGBT people? Hope0617 (talk) 16:53, 13 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

A vaguely worded law is still a law. Its intent seems clear. See below for maybe splitting the tan coloring, with a darker/oranger? shade for Russia. We might also consider coloring Bahrain and Jordan if we have RS's that people are being targeted under the law. Kwamikagami (talk) 21:17, 6 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Russia's arrest 2024[edit]

Cross-posting from Template talk:World laws pertaining to homosexual relationships and expression

There has been an arrest in Russia under their anti-LGBTQ+ laws - would it be possible to change the colour of Russia on this map to reflect this? Source: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/mar/20/russia-two-detained-under-new-anti-lgbtq-law

I feel like Russia should now be "Prison, with arrests or detention" - orange.

I think there is also merit (from previous discussions above) adding in stripped areas over Ukraine that Russia is occupying, as LGBTQ+ can be subjected to these laws there. With a note outlining these are from laws in occupied Ukraine. Jamzze (talk) 20:14, 20 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Jamzze: Sorry that my health has been horrible, but I think the crackdown falls under laws restricting freedom of expression and association. There has to be a law or crackdown against same-sex intercourse for Russia to become orange. Regarding the striped areas, I had that sorted by creating and exporting the disputed shape in Illustrator and then pasting the shape in good old TextEdit. --Minoa (talk) 23:37, 21 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Hi @Minoa - I am sorry to hear about your health, thank you for taking the time to still have a look at this.
For this visual, I think changing is warrented. As it is titled "Worldwide laws regarding same-sex intercourse, unions and expression", the detention of LGBTQ+ people in Russia, as a detention due to their expression of being gay, lesbian, etc., has changed the legal landscape.
This visual, from how it is titled and what it covers, it not just about same-sex intercourse. It is also how you express it and your ability to have a relationship, etc.
I think maybe the key needs to be reworked.
  • Same-sex intercourse legal
  • Same-sex intercourse legal, with restrictions new one
  • At least some types of same-sex intercourse illegal or effectively illegal
Jamzze (talk) 19:50, 22 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Jamzze: Hello, this idea is quite a big change that may require more than one person to review the idea, and if accepted, the colour scheme. I think I need help on reviewing this idea. --Minoa (talk) 16:28, 25 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Minoa Hi Minoa - completely understand, it is a big change - but I think it would help better reflect the complexities facing LGBTQ+ people.
Just putting together some ideas of how this might be created.
Same-sex intercourse legal
  • Colours: light blue to dark blue
    • Marriage
    • Extraterritorial marriage
    • Civil unions
    • Limited domestic
    • Limited foreign
    • Optional certification
    • None
Same-sex intercourse legal; with relationship/ expression restrictions (maybe as stripes?)
  • Colours: grey to dark yellow
    • Restrictions of expression
    • Prison, with arrests or detention
Same-sex intercourse partially or fully illegal
  • Colours: dark red to black?
    • Death
    • Prison; death not enforced
    • Death under militias
    • Prison, with arrests or detention
    • Prison, not enforced1
Jamzze (talk) 09:37, 30 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Messing w the color scheme would affect a lot of maps, and open a whole can of worms with people edit-warring over the best colors. The last time we changed the colors, the arguments went on for years.
If we do this, I think just lighter and darker tan shouldn't cause problems, or a shade halfway between tan and orange. The other colors should be left alone (esp. grey for no laws either way).
Which countries beside Russia would be changed? China? Iraq? Kwamikagami (talk) 20:28, 6 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Here's the color half-way between:
 
Restrictions of expression with arrests or detention
Here's a color 2/3 tan, 1/3 orange:
 
Restrictions of expression with arrests or detention
That seems better. 50-50 looks too orange IMO. We might want it even closer to tan, but I'll upload 1/3 orange for now. Kwamikagami (talk) 21:36, 6 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Of course, if ppl don't like this we revert. It's just easier to judge if we can see the effect in the articles. The template on WP-en has the new legend, those on other wikis don't. Kwamikagami (talk) 22:09, 6 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
In China, a woman was given 10 years for writing a 'boys-love' novel. Of course, that's quite a bit different than arresting people for association, so it doesn't feel right to color China the same even though it would fit under my wording in the template. I'll change the wording to 'restrictions on association w arrest', but of course this can be modified. Kwamikagami (talk) 22:18, 6 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Rojava[edit]

Sources seem to show that while there are no protections against discrimination in wikipedia:Rojava, there are also no laws against homosexuality in Rojava:

"Just because there are no laws against LGBTQ in Rojava, this doesn’t mean there are rights." - Syrian Kurdish trans woman, Ziya Gorani, quoted by Al-Jazeera

An article from The Intercept quotes something similar from a trans woman named Zoza, "Technically being LGBT isn’t criminalized in Rojava, giving it a reputation as one of the most tolerant regions of the Middle East. But, as Zoza put it, “there’s no law against harassing LGBT people either.” ".

The wikipedia:Syrian Democratic Forces has also stated that while wikipedia:The Queer Insurrection and Liberation Army is not a part of the SDF, it has a "deep respect for human rights, including the rights of homosexuals".

Therefore, I believe the approximate territory controlled by Rojava should be colored gray, as it seems like homosexuality is legal, but it doesn't seem like there are protections against discrimination nor recognition of same-sex relationships. GeometryCrown (talk) 16:13, 14 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

South Asia[edit]

Hello.

I want some help in editing the map being used on LGBT rights by country or territory (Template:World laws pertaining to homosexual relationships and expression).

The information concering South Asia appears to be incorrect:

  • Pakistan should be changed to "Prison, with arrests or detention"
  • Bangladesh and Sri Lanka shoud be changed to "Prison, not enforced" (I have no idea why Bangladesh is coloured as having same-sex relationship legal protections).

There have been no arrets in Bangladesh or Sri Lanka during the past several years so I doubt they should be included.

I have a feeling that Pakistan might be controversial, but the following do state that there are arrests of LGBTQ in the country, especially the UK foreign office summary:

Pakistan

https://yaledailynews.com/blog/2021/10/08/pakistani-courts-confirm-bail-for-yale-alum-after-lgbtq-inspired-photoshoot/

https://www.tribuneindia.com/news/archive/world/pakistan-police-arrest-couple-facilitators-over-gay-marriage-94974

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/62554b85e90e0729fef7bb5f/Pakistan_Sexual_orientation_and_gender_identity_or_expression.pdf https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/pakistan-country-policy-and-information-notes/country-policy-and-information-note-sexual-orientation-and-gender-identity-and-expression-pakistan-april-2022-accessible--2

Shironese (talk) 15:15, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I thought I would add more evidence to support my claim: https://database.ilga.org/criminalisation-consensual-same-sex-sexual-acts

The IGLA database claims that Bangladesh, Pakistan and Sri Lanka have cases where homosexuals have been arrested in the past three years.

In Pakistan, it furthermore claims that transgender people have been arrested as well, and that religious morality at a local level can lead to arrests of homosexuals and transgender peoples.

Furthermore the death penality is still a possibility in Pakisan: https://www.forbes.com/sites/jamiewareham/2023/11/30/severe-spike-in-arrests-and-prosecutions-of-lgbtq-people-in-2023/?sh=3449e80a3a3e https://www.thepinknews.com/2023/05/17/lgbtq-death-penalty-idahobit/ https://www.bbc.com/news/world-43822234

So technically I would use the following colours:

Pakistan: Up to death (this is particuarly noteworthy because there are areas where Sharia Law can be enforced on top of the legalities) Bangladesh and Sri Lanka: Prison, not enforced (I think no one has been jailed either two countries in the past three years) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Shironese (talk • contribs) 15:38, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Shironese (talk) 15:38, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

New category[edit]

I think the new (Russia) category should be used for countries that arrest people despite same-sex rel. not being explicitly illegal, under laws for 'debauchery' etc. I'm not sure about Ivory Coast and Gabon, as the law has changed recently, so have left those grey. But including others in the 2023 ILGA report.[9]

Should Turkey be included? Arrests for illegal marches wouldn't count, but there might be more than that.

This is a first pass, so sorry for anything I get wrong. Kwamikagami (talk) 07:29, 23 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

No, Turkey shouldn't be included because we need reliable sources and not some exaggerated claims of a Portuguese blogger. I support this new category, but it should be clearly defined and not broadly interpreted. Cuban police detained gay rights activists taking part in an unauthorized pride march in 2019. Should Cuba, Nicaragua and Venezuela be included just because the US government labels them as "undemocratic"? No. Should all muslim-majority countries be included just because they are muslim-majority? We should not exaggerate flaws of muslim-majority countries, while at the same time praising and exaggerating India's and Israel's LGBT "achievements". That snacks of anti-muslim racism. Wikipedia should not be biased. Cyanmax (talk) 12:20, 23 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Kwamikagami not a fan of this edit, it seems like those arrests are extralegal, and there are no actual laws in most of those countries that prohibit LGBT expression. This is the equivalent of saying that there are anti-Black laws in the US because they are disproportionately mistreated by law enforcement. Kaleetan (talk) 00:17, 24 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
This isn't about Islam (many of these countries don't have a significant muslim population, and no sharia), and I tried to exclude arrests for unauthorized parades and demonstrations, as well as cross-dressing in muslim countries that have laws against men trying to pass as women, which may be more about gender segregation than anything lgbt. But many countries, christian and muslim, have debauchery laws that are used to target gays. I don't see how that's different from sodomy laws. Sodomy is just 'unnatural' sex, including heterosexual, such as oral sex or the cowgirl position. If we count countries that have sodomy laws that are used to target gays, then we should do the same with debauchery laws. I also don't think the ILGA report was targeting muslim countries: they were just listing countries where they have reports of arrests etc.
Technically, we shouldn't use the orange 'illegal' color for countries with sodomy laws, unless they specifically include homosexuality. Or if we do, we should include debauchery laws under orange.
But as I said above, I may have misjudged some of the countries, both in those I included and those I excluded. Kwamikagami (talk) 00:42, 24 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I self-reverted pending this discussion. No rush: we haven't included such countries for years, so we should probably take our time. Kwamikagami (talk) 05:36, 24 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Re. the appearance of anti-muslim bias, I'm afraid that can't be helped. In any objective coverage, Africa and muslim countries are going to look bad. Take for example file:LGBT_rights_at_the_UN_(2011).svg -- opposition to recognition of lgbt rights came almost exclusively from african and muslim countries. The only other objectors were north korea, st lucia and the solomon islands. And many of the opposing african countries were not motivated by islamic values, but instead would couch their opposition in christian terms (same with st lucia and the solomons).
I suspect that for most measures of human rights, Africa and the islamic world are going to look bad. (And also of course authoritarian countries like Russia and China.) That's just the situation of the world. It would be irresponsible of us to try to downplay that for fear of appearing biased against Islam or the third world. Kwamikagami (talk) 05:57, 24 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Ok, agree. But at least Iraq should be coloured the same as Russia and all those eye-catching rings should be removed althogether. Honestly, they are the first thing that draws attention when someone looks at the map. Anyone can read about those few individual cases on their respective wikipedia articles: "Recognition of same-sex unions in Cambodia" etc. Cyanmax (talk) 07:31, 24 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I can support the removal of the big rings: I have no idea why they were larger than the small country dots, but I left them in when I converted to map to a text-editable format. --Minoa (talk) 13:57, 24 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Regarding the rings for exceptional recognition of same-sex marriages I think they should only be included on the map if that has happened repeatedly and/or recently (as in Nepal). The one case from Cambodia in 1995 is in my opinion not relevant enough as it doesn't reflect the legal situation in that country.
Kugelfisch002 (talk) 17:34, 24 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Another option, we can just paint Nepal with dark blue and gray stripes and remove all the rings altogether. Cyanmax (talk) 01:23, 25 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Nepal hasn't actually recognised same-sex marriage. https://www.hrw.org/news/2023/12/14/did-nepal-achieve-marriage-equality-not-quite-yet SamanthaWinning (talk) 08:22, 25 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I remember there being a discussion on a different website about how many Muslims talk about the legality of homosexuality, in the sense that just because homosexuality isn't illegal, it doesn't mean it is legal because there is no law permitting homosexuality - for example just because there is no law banning homosexual marriage, that doesn't mean gay people can marry. In this case there is no law permitting homosexuality and cases where homosexuals and transsexuals are arrested. SamanthaWinning (talk) 08:25, 25 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Bangladesh and Pakistan can be included in this category regarding transsexuals. There still seems to be arrests and prosecutions of transsexuals in both countries, the former due to Islamic morality and corruption, and the latter due to only a certain type of transgender being allowed. SamanthaWinning (talk) 08:17, 25 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
No, their anti-gay laws supersede the morality laws. We can change their color to orange. Cyanmax (talk) 10:04, 25 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yes I agree with that. Please update the map to show the two countries as orange. SamanthaWinning (talk) 15:30, 29 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Western Sahara[edit]

I haven't found any evidence of Western Sahara criminalizing homosexuality from reliable sources.

Both ILGA and Human Dignity Trus maps leave it blank

https://ilga.org/ilga-world-maps/

https://www.humandignitytrust.org/lgbt-the-law/map-of-criminalisation/


Unless I'm missing something I think the Polisario-controlled teritory should be change to Legal with the Morrocon-controlled teritory left the same. ProfessionallyAverage (talk) 17:34, 25 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Hello, Sahrawi here (thank you @WikiBunny2K1 for pointing this out!).
Technically to fully confirm one should check the Penal Code of the SADR. A Master's Thesis on Sahrawi legislation suggests on page 42 the following:
El principio de igualdad ante la ley aparece recogido en el Artículo 26 de la Constitución saharaui, que dice que “todos los ciudadanos son iguales ante la ley, tanto para la protección como para la sanción”. A este artículo se añadió el actual Artículo 25, que dice que “todos los ciudadanos gozan de los derechos y libertades reconocidos en la constitución, sin discriminación basada en raza, etnia, color, sexo o lengua, política, religión u opinión”. No hay que olvidar, con todo, que este principio es interpretado desde unos parámetros culturales diferentes de los occidentales, y así por ejemplo el art. 162 del Código Penal castiga con mayor severidad algunos de los delitos de naturaleza sexual cuando estos son de tipo homosexual.

The principle of equality before the law is reflected in Article 26 of the Sahrawi Constitution, which says that “all citizens are equal before the law, both for protection and punishment.” The current Article 25 was added to this article, which says that “all citizens enjoy the rights and freedoms recognised in the Constitution, without discrimination based on race, ethnicity, color, sex or language, politics, religion or opinion.” We must not forget, however, that this principle is interpreted from cultural parameters different from Western ones, and thus, for example, art. 162 of the Penal Code punishes some crimes of a sexual nature more severely when they are of a homosexual nature.

[...] los artículos 169 a 172 del Código Penal castigan el adulterio, y aunque lo hacen con la misma pena para hombre o mujer, [...]

[...] articles 169 to 172 of the Penal Code punish adultery, and although they do so with the same penalty for men or women, [...]

The thesis quotes this information based on Law 02/2010 (reform of Law 01/2006), the then Penal Code of the Sahrawi Republic. So, based on this interpretation extra-marital sex is deemed illegal for all Sahrawis irrespective of sexual orientation, with more severe punishments for cases of a homosexual nature (the thesis doesn't explicitly cite it so we can't fully know for sure).

To help us clear some doubts the Spanish Commission for Refugee Assistance has an inform on the situation of LGBTI+ rights in the territory of Western Sahara. The document is mainly focused on how the rights of the Sahrawi population are mainly violated by the Moroccan occupation irrespective of sexual orientation, including the use of sexual violence (I have heard and read reports in the past of men being raped with bottles by the Moroccan police).
The text cites the following when it comes to the legislation of the SADR:
En el caso de la República Árabe Saharaui Democrática la legislación respecto del colectivo LGBTI es inexistente. Específicamente, “la Constitución de la RASD no alude a la homosexualidad ni a ninguna otra práctica sexual; es decir, no la toca, no la castiga,” pero tampoco la asume como una realidad, la omite, la excluye; no la considera un fenómeno social que sea necesario poner sobre la mesa de discusiones. Los saharauis, por el momento, “están más preocupados por la liberación de su territorio del dominio marroquí.” Al no ser reconocida por la constitución ni por otro cuerpo legal, no hay ningún tipo de protección para el colectivo en caso de discriminación o violencia.

In the case of the Sahrawi Arab Democratic Republic, legislation regarding the LGBTI community is non-existent. Specifically, “the SADR Constitution does not refer to homosexuality or any other sexual practice; that is, it does not touch it, it does not punish it,” but neither does it assume it as a reality, it omits it, it excludes it; it does not consider it a social phenomenon that needs to be put on the discussion table. The Sahrawis, for the moment, “are more concerned about the liberation of their territory from Moroccan occupation.” Since it is not recognised by the constitution or any other legal body, there is no type of protection for the group in case of discrimination or violence.

Como se ha dicho también anteriormente, la Constitución de la República Árabe Saharaui Democrática no hace mención alguna al colectivo LGBTI. Esto se debe a que el pueblo saharaui sabe que existen formas diversas de relacionarse sexualmente, pero no considera que se trate de un aspecto al que haya que aplicarle una ley, al menos no en su país, pues perciben esta realidad como algo ajeno a ellos, como ausente del Sahara, [...]

As has also been said previously, the Constitution of the Sahrawi Arab Democratic Republic does not make any mention of the LGBTI community. This is because the Sahrawi people know that there are different ways of relating sexually, but they do not consider that it is an aspect to which a law must be applied, at least not in their country, since they perceive this reality as something foreign to them, as absent from the Sahara, [...]

Es por todo lo explicado que la sociedad no da cabida a la posibilidad de la existencia de la homosexualidad o la transexualidad y esta comunidad no se atreve a manifestarse, por lo que no existe información alguna sobre casos de ataques o detenciones homosexuales o transexuales.

For all that has been explained, society does not allow for the possibility of the existence of homosexuality or transsexuality and this community does not dare to express itself, which is why there is no information on cases of homosexual or transsexual attacks or arrests.

This information is mainly based on an interview conducted by a Mexican academic to a representative of the Sahrawi Republic in Mexico as part of an article on sexual diversity in Muslim societies and in specific the Sahrawi case, which you can find by clicking here. All publicly-available information on this topic is in Spanish, I haven't found any article from Sahrawis ourselves covering or discussing the topic in (Hassaniya or Standard) Arabic.

TL;DR: Sahrawis don't see LGBT+ rights as something we need to legislate on, same-sex relations are technically illegal as extra-marital sex is illegal and same-sex marriages aren't contemplated, there's no laws protecting against discrimination but no laws actively persecuting the community. There are no reports of any detention of LGBT+ Sahrawis (which exist, including somewhat openly, even if they face societal rejection). I think the SADR should be highlighted as "unclear", it's not openly illegalised after all. Tidjani Saleh (talk) 09:27, 27 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you for the in-depth clarification!
According to this, it would be most fitting to color the SADR on the map yellow, given that some homosexual activity is illegal but no known arrests or detentions have been made in the past five years. WikiBunny2K1 (talk) 09:40, 27 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you for pointing out to it @WikiBunny2K1! It's always my pleasure to help shed some clarity in my country ^^
I will edit the map accordingly then, if someone can point out to me where to correct it on Wikipedia that would be great! Tidjani Saleh (talk) 09:42, 27 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
If you upload a new version of this map, it will automatically update on every page that uses this file.
FYI, there's no page for LGBT rights in the Sahrawi Arab Democratic Republic ;) WikiBunny2K1 (talk) 09:51, 27 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Did W.Sahara and Iraq, which just illegalized. Kwamikagami (talk) 00:18, 28 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Can you also update Bangladesh and Pakistan to orange as per the discussion directly above? SamanthaWinning (talk) 14:58, 29 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Pakistan[edit]

Pakistan still has the death penalty for homosexuality through sharia law, but it remains legally unenforced (even if extrajudicial enforcement happens).

Homosexuality: The countries where it is illegal to be gay (bbc.com)

Pakistan | Human Dignity Trust

Pakistan | Outright International

Therefore the shade of orange used should be the darker one.

SamanthaWinning (talk) 04:32, 2 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Well then Pakistan should be colored the same as Saudi Arabia. There's no definition and description provided for that darker shade of orange, that's the problem. Cyanmax (talk) 06:16, 2 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It is the same shade of orange as Saudi Arabia! I specifically picked the shade by clicking on that country! It might be hard to see the contrast on your computer because I can't even see the difference between Pakistan and Bangladesh on my computer so check again, but it's certainly the right shade. SamanthaWinning (talk) 06:26, 2 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Ok, can u please color Qatar, UAE and Yemen with the same color? Because they have unenforced death penalty too. Cyanmax (talk) 06:42, 2 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Our article does not support this. First ref above says 'unclear' and 'could', not 'is'. 2nd ref says 'prison'. Only the 3rd supports the claim. I don't know if it's a RS, but it contradicts everything else. So no new evidence since the last time we went over this. Kwamikagami (talk) 07:30, 3 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I reverted your edit because yellow is factually incorrect. None of the sources available anywhere supports yellow for Bangladesh and Pakistan considering there have been arrests in the past five years. If you want to update the map then use the correct shade. SamanthaWinning (talk) 02:30, 7 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Rings[edit]

My suggestion to remove those distracting rings has already been supported by two users. I would like to urge other users to express their views on the issue. There are two cases from Nepal and two more cases from Cambodia and India respectively. So it's not even 5 cases, while the rings are disproportionately noticeable and distracting. Moreover, one case from Cambodia was 30 years ago. Since then there have been no new confirmed cases. One case from India was reported in 2011, and contradicts the recent supreme court ruling. My argument is that anyone can read about those individual cases on their respective wikipedia articles: "Recognition of same-sex unions in Cambodia", "Recognition of same-sex unions in Nepal", "Recognition of same-sex unions in India". Cyanmax (talk) 08:14, 2 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I'm not sure I buy your argument, but I agree that individual cases probably aren't worth showing when we gloss over so many other details. Nepal would be an issue, but they're now state-wide. Removed. Kwamikagami (talk) 07:18, 3 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Nepal isn't state wide. It's only marriages to foreign spouses that is. SamanthaWinning (talk) 02:51, 7 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Can somebody explain to me why those rings are back again? It violates the consensus. Cyanmax (talk) 12:50, 7 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Removed them SamanthaWinning (talk) 12:59, 7 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks. Can you please update this map too? https://en.m.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Recognition_of_same-sex_unions_in_Asia&wprov=rarw1#/media/File%3AAsia_homosexuality_laws.svg Cyanmax (talk) 13:48, 7 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Nepal and the rest of South Asia[edit]

@Kwamikagami

There are numerous problems with your edits:

1) Nepal does not allow gay marriage yet, except for foreign spouses: Nepal Supreme Court delivers historic ruling in favour of same-sex marriage (yahoo.com)

2) Bangladesh and Pakistan have had arrests within the past five years according to numerous sources posted throughout this talk page and should be a shade of orange; furthermore Pakistan still had a Sharia Law derived allowance to enforce the death penalty but it remains unenforced.

Do not update the map unless Bangladesh and Pakistan are a shade of orange. SamanthaWinning (talk) 02:35, 7 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Please provide sources for your claims. I've read many of the sources above and they don't support what they claim to, or are contradicted by other sources. Kwamikagami (talk) 02:51, 7 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Which claim? The majority of the sources for the claims have been posted throughout this talk page. and I can repost a few of them here again.
The following links lists that Bangladesh and Pakistan have had arrests in the past five years.
https://database.ilga.org/criminalisation-consensual-same-sex-sexual-acts
https://yaledailynews.com/blog/2021/10/08/pakistani-courts-confirm-bail-for-yale-alum-after-lgbtq-inspired-photoshoot/
Country policy and information note: sexual orientation and gender identity, Bangladesh, September 2023 (accessible) - GOV.UK (www.gov.uk)
Our Identities under Arrest - ILGA World
https://www.tribuneindia.com/news/archive/world/pakistan-police-arrest-couple-facilitators-over-gay-marriage-94974
The following links lists that Pakistan has had at least arrests in the past five years and many state that Pakistan still had the death penalty on the books:
Homosexuality: The countries where it is illegal to be gay (bbc.com)
Pakistan | Human Dignity Trust
Pakistan | Outright International
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/62554b85e90e0729fef7bb5f/Pakistan_Sexual_orientation_and_gender_identity_or_expression.pdf
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/pakistan-country-policy-and-information-notes/country-policy-and-information-note-sexual-orientation-and-gender-identity-and-expression-pakistan-april-2022-accessible--2
https://www.forbes.com/sites/jamiewareham/2023/11/30/severe-spike-in-arrests-and-prosecutions-of-lgbtq-people-in-2023/?sh=3449e80a3a3e
https://www.thepinknews.com/2023/05/17/lgbtq-death-penalty-idahobit/
Additional sources for Nepal as well:
Nepal Supreme Court delivers historic ruling in favour of same-sex marriage (yahoo.com)
If you are arguing about Pakistan and its death penalty, then it still should not be yellow by any means. Even if you can somehow claim that there aren't any arrests of gay people (and there have been arrests of gay people), there is still enforcement of sharia law extrajudically at a local level according to the reports above so it's not just clutching at straws, it's downright incorrect. Furthermore harrasment of the LGBTQ community, including transgenders, by the police is common in Pakistan according to the sources above so the idea that this map can represent living conditions by using yellow is also far fetched.
SamanthaWinning (talk) 02:58, 7 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Furthermore I notice that the claim for Sri Lanka having arrests in the past five years is also incorrect. The claim given in this talk page, that two lesbians were taken by police and sent to a hospital for homosexuality, was actually due to severe suicidal tendencies and the women were relased the next day and were never arrested: Indo-SL lesbian couple seeking matrimony released | The Morning . The other link in this talk page also does not state anything about arrests in the past five years. SamanthaWinning (talk) 03:39, 7 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Kwamikagami
So to summarise:
Pakistan: dark orange or light orange (imprisonment, death penalty on books but not (or not yet)) OR (arrests, detention, imprisonment or de-facto illegal); it seems that there are numerous sources saying that Pakistan still has the death penalty on the books, but that it has never been enforced and is unlikely to be ever enforced, but this seems to be a controversial conclusion on Wikipedia.
Bangladesh: orange (arrests, detention, imprisonment or de-facto illegal)
Sri Lanka: yellow (no arrests/detentions over past five years)
Nepal: light purple (limited recognition (foreign residency rights))
Sources
Pakistan and Bangladesh have been sourced above.
The two sources that were provided in the Comoros, Maldives, Sri Lanka subsection above that changed Sri Lanka to orange have been supersceeded by a updated source clarifying the situation as being related to suicidal tendencies and nothing to do with homosexuality per se: Indo-SL lesbian couple seeking matrimony released | The Morning (and the other source in the subsection did not state that arrests happened in the past five years).
You jumped the gun with Nepal and same-sex marriage; it's only foreign residency rights and that's sourced from: Nepal Supreme Court delivers historic ruling in favour of same-sex marriage (yahoo.com) SamanthaWinning (talk) 11:39, 7 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Furthermore to add to the discussion about Pakistan and the death penalty:
Gay relationships are still criminalised in 72 countries, report finds | LGBTQ+ rights | The Guardian
The Guardian also has Pakistan as imposing the death penality on the books but unenforced in reality. SamanthaWinning (talk) 12:18, 7 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

A double decision by Supreme Court of Nepal?[edit]

It seems that there was already a decision in 2017 by the Supreme Court of Nepal that instructed the Government of Nepal to allow foreign same-sex married couples to obtain non-tourist visas.

Nepal: Court Orders Recognition of Same-Sex Spouse | Human Rights Watch (hrw.org)

What actually changed from 2017 to 2024 that the map needs updating? SamanthaWinning (talk) 13:10, 7 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

We don't have any official statements from the Ministry of Home Affairs and the Supreme Court. I checked both the Ministry of Home Affairs website and the Supreme court website, and I could not find any information regarding same-sex marriage recognition. Why wouldn't they make an official statement? We live in 2024! We had a similar situation with Armenia. A couple of wiki users swore that they were informed by the Ministry of Home Affairs that same-sex marriage is legal in Armenia. But why would the ministry whisper them instead of making an official statement? Eventually that turned out to be a hoax. They managed to deceive wikipedia for five years! We should see if any foreign same-sex marriages are actually registered, or if any clearer or attributed statements from the ministry ever come out. Cyanmax (talk) 14:26, 7 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Retrieved from "https://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=File_talk:World_laws_pertaining_to_homosexual_relationships_and_expression.svg&oldid=874806535"