Commons:Valued image candidates/pousseur intraitable.jpg

pousseur intraitable.jpg

declined

Image
Nominated by	Jebulon (talk) on 2010-06-21 22:26 (UTC)
Scope	Nominated as the most valued image on Commons within the scope: Pusher boats
Used in	Global usage
Reason	A "pusher" at work on the Seine river in Paris. There is no specific category, but one can find a lot of other pictures on this theme in "Commons". I think this one could be promoted as the most valuable, because of details and not so bad quality. -- Jebulon (talk)
Review (criteria)	Categories don't distinguish pushing and pulling. :( --Ikar.us (talk) 08:03, 22 June 2010 (UTC) Sorry, but I find the background very distracting. Have found two examples where the outline is better visible. --Ikar.us (talk) 08:03, 22 June 2010 (UTC)  Question We are examinating "tugboats" which push, is that? Also called "towboats", or am I wrong? --Myrabella (talk) 21:41, 22 June 2010 (UTC) Oh, yes! en:tugboat includes both, so I didn't search for another term. --Ikar.us (talk) 22:16, 22 June 2010 (UTC) So I'd suggest to change the scope to "Towboat" (in the singular), the right term as it seems, matching the link and the title of the en:WP article. However an English-native speaker may help: this tug is pushing, could it be called a "towboat"? --Myrabella (talk) 23:36, 22 June 2010 (UTC) The article says towboat is American, outside they're called pushers. I suggest to keep the unambiguous and easy-to-understand descriptive term. --Ikar.us (talk) 23:43, 22 June 2010 (UTC) OK, that will be clearer (actually I had already asked the question). --Myrabella (talk) 23:52, 22 June 2010 (UTC)  Question Sorry to be irksome, but shouldn't we say "Pusher boat" rather than "Pusher ships"? The first term seems much more in use than the second one ([1] vs [2]). I don't know well the differences between "boat", "ship" and "vessel" (neither in French between "bateau", "navire" et "vaisseau"), but a ship is commonly a rather big boat, isn't it? And a tug or towboat is usually smaller than the ship it pulls/pushes. As instance, the tiny one in File:Argenteuil - Seine pousseur.jpg can be said a boat but not a ship. --Myrabella (talk) 08:28, 23 June 2010 (UTC) I think vessel is the generic term. To be a ship and not a boat, a vessel has or had to, depending on context: have three or more yard-rigged masts be equipped to accomodate its crew over an extended period of time, thus operate independent of harbours be heavier than 500 register tons have the military rank of a battalion be able to carry other vessels be able to transport any payload exept their crew and equipment … None of these criteria is useful for pushers, only the 2. could be applied, IMO. --Ikar.us (talk) 09:20, 23 June 2010 (UTC) So => "Pusher boat"? --Myrabella (talk) 09:22, 23 June 2010 (UTC) Yes, but mainly because it's more in use. Not because of any of the criteria. There are pushers which push a convoy all the way along a long river and house their crew, while the pullers which maneuver ocean ships within a harbour are much bigger, but exchange their crew after each work shift. --Ikar.us (talk) 09:37, 23 June 2010 (UTC)  CommentIMO, prefixes "tug" or "tow" are not good here, because they don't distinguish between push and pull. What I show, and what I submit to your judgement "pushes". Then, it is a "pusher" (term in use). Furthermore, nobody in French can say that "my" boat (or ship) is a "remorqueur". I think that we all agree. Now, is it a "pusher vessel", a "pusher boat" or a "pusher ship" ? The category "pusher ship" exists in "Commons", but shows pushers and pullers... What shall we do ? If boat=bateau and ship=navire, then it's a boat, to me. Because it's more natural to me to say "bateau-pousseur" than "navire-pousseur", as I say "bateau-lavoir" and "navire-hopital"... As you like it ! Maybe an English native speaking reviewer could help ? Britts are specialists of naval things, aren't they ? "Rule Britannia", as said Surcouf... --Jebulon (talk) 15:25, 23 June 2010 (UTC) Brits aren't specialists in inland navigation. The biggest pusher boats seem to be in the USA, on the Mississippi river. --Ikar.us (talk) 15:34, 23 June 2010 (UTC) It was a (bad) joke...--Jebulon (talk) 16:09, 23 June 2010 (UTC) Sorry to insist: the more I see this one, the more I find it more illustrative than others. One can see that it "pushes" something (a barge), but what it "pushes" is nor distracting neither disturbing in the scope. In other words : it's a pushing "pusher", but only a "pusher".--Jebulon (talk) 17:13, 25 June 2010 (UTC) I've proposed a new candidate, with a less distracting background, hoping it's a true pusher! --Myrabella (talk) 05:11, 27 June 2010 (UTC) MVR Scores: 1. pousseur intraitable.jpg: 0 <-- 2. Schubverband Havel.jpg: 0 3. Schubboot Victor Millet,F.JPG: -1 4. Duwboot Kraaijenberg in sluis Maas-Waalkanaal, heumen (Gld, NL).JPG: 0 5. ENI 02006792 JAMAICA (03).JPG: -1 6. RT tug pusher4.jpg: +2 => File:pousseur intraitable.jpg: Declined. <-- File:Schubverband Havel.jpg: Declined. File:Schubboot Victor Millet,F.JPG: Declined. File:Duwboot Kraaijenberg in sluis Maas-Waalkanaal, heumen (Gld, NL).JPG: Declined. File:ENI 02006792 JAMAICA (03).JPG: Declined. File:RT tug pusher4.jpg: Promoted. --Myrabella (talk) 22:00, 4 July 2010 (UTC)