File talk:MAP Naish ChineseSW AlexisMichaud.jpg

Following a message from Fæ, "this appears to be a derived work with a pre-existing map", here is a clarification concerning authorship.

The file was produced at CNRS-LACITO by Jean-Michel Roynard, using Adobe Illustrator. It was produced using public-domain information (which, as we thought, does not require citation) to create a canvas. The choice of names (e.g.: Nyag-chu, Yalong, 雅砻江) was done by us. We adapted pictographs from existing sources, but considered that our use (changing the colour, proportions etc.) could be considered as *fair use*. Thus, the map was published in a volume edited by Christine Mathieu, and we adapted the dragon symbol from her book but did not think that this required citing the book:

Mathieu, Christine. 2003. A history and anthropological study of the ancient kingdoms of the Sino-Tibetan borderland - Naxi and Mosuo (Mellen Studies in Anthropology, 11). Lewiston, NY: Edwin Mellen Pr.

The map is published in the following book: Christine Mathieu & Cindy Ho (eds.), Quentin Roosevelt’s China. Ancestral Realms of the Naxi, 92–101. Stuttgart: Arnoldsche Art Publishers. 2011. The book has been out of print for several years now (at least since 2017) and there is no electronic version for sale either.

As stated in exchanges with Fæ, we are grateful for the opportunity to clarify the status of this document, and to add metadata: importantly, adding credit for the central role of Jean-Michel Roynard, who created the map following specifications that I and the volume editors had provided (it's, in a real sense, collaborative work). His role had not been mentioned in my hasty deposit (as I remember, my first-ever deposit on Wikimedia Commons). We are committed to providing all necessary clarifications such as links to the terms of use (including Adobe Illustrator?)

Fæ mentioned:

you can also convert the tag to a deletion request if there's a longer discussion to have 'on the record'

but I'm afraid I don't know how to do that. Help & guidance is much appreciated.

With many thanks --AlexisMichaud (talk) 10:51, 18 February 2021 (UTC)

This appears to be sufficient background for anyone wanting to verify copyright. I do not have access to the sources you mention, but presumably the books are all rights reserved, but the contents reproduced are derived works with minor changes such as labels.

With regard to pictographs, they might be too simple for copyright, again I have not made an assessment, so am proceeding in good faith.

With regard to the underpinning map, if this was generated by Roynard using a tool, or copied from a public domain map source, this would be worth spelling out more clearly what it is.

In the meantime I have removed the tag and don't think this is of immediate concern to need a deletion request, which adds a limit of 7 days to discussion, something that probably would not help you.

Thanks for your summary. --Fæ (talk) 14:03, 18 February 2021 (UTC)