Commons:Featured picture candidates/Image:Burrowing Crayfish in his burrow.jpg

From Wikimedia Commons, the free media repository
Jump to navigation Jump to search

Image:Burrowing Crayfish in his burrow.jpg, not featured[edit]

Short description

  •  InfoA male Crayfish (Astacidae) is digging his burrow.
  •  Infocolor = pink name = Astacidae; regnum = Animalia phylum = Arthropoda subphylum = Crustacea classis = Malacostraca ordo = Decapodasubordo = Pleocyemata infraordo = Astacidea superfamilia = Astacoideafamilia = Astacidaefamilia_authority = Latreille, 1802-1803 subdivision_ranks = [[Genus|Genera]subdivision= Astacus'Austropotamobius'Pacifastacus
  •  Info created, uploaded and nominated by Mbz1 --Mbz1 01:20, 23 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
  •  Support --Mbz1 01:20, 23 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
  •  Support Very nice :) makes me hungry --Ice201 01:37, 23 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
  •  Oppose Subject is hardly visible and is not properly identified. Picture moreover fails on composition and lighting. Lycaon 05:27, 23 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
  •  Oppose Ack Lycaon. - Keta 09:51, 23 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
  •  Comment I'd like to tell you the story how I took the picture. Yesterday my friend and me went to the pond. We both had our cameras. I looked down at an interesting plant and saw a hole in a mud. I had no idea who dug the hole. It was empty. I showed it to my friend and said :"let's wait and see, if we could spot somebody." My friend was not fond of the idea. He told me: "Why to watch that empty hole? Let's better take pictures of these red sun-lit dragonflies." I've decided to wait next to the hole while my friend was taking pictures of dragonflies. In half-an-hour I've noticed some movement inside the hole. I called my friend with excitement and told him: "Look it is a crayfish hole. He came out." My friend told me: "So what. Only look at him - he's all covered with mud and who will like that "hole" composition! I'm sure it will not make a nice FP on Wikipedia." I've tried to argue that Wikipedia is for learning, that it is very, very, very rare to see a crayfish in process of digging his burrow, but my friend went back to taking pictures of red (and blue) dragonflies. While we were arguing the crayfish disappeared back inside the hole. So I waited for another half-hour and at last was able to take 2 quick shots. I proudly showed them to my friend. He was not impressed. He told me:"So what. In the end it is the results what matters."--Mbz1 12:48, 23 July 2007 (UTC)Mbz1[reply]
  •  Comment As with all my nominations I like, when people vote and it does not matter, if these votes are "support" or "oppose". I'd rather 10 people oppose the picture than five support it. For me the only thing that matters is the count of the votes.--Mbz1 13:01, 23 July 2007 (UTC)Mbz1[reply]
  •  Support Muddy...but very interesting! The subject is clearly identifiable with the explanations. The crayfish is not perfectly sharp but this picture has a great encyclopedic value. Vassil 20:50, 23 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
  •  Oppose a interesting and for sure useful photo. But quality- and composition-wise it is not a FP. Try to put it into the right articles in the wikipedias. Right now it doesnt even have a category or is in any gallery - this way it is quite difficult to find it for someone who needs such a pic. --AngMoKio 21:23, 23 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
  •  Oppose Some organic matter in a hole. Why candidate for FP? --Karelj 21:49, 23 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
  •  Oppose awful composition. Please stop nominating images just for fun, it's really hard to take your nominations seriously -- Gorgo 00:12, 24 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
    • Then do not take them seriously as I do not take seriously your comments. How, for example, one could take a comment about awful composition seriously. I did not make the composition. It is where Crayfishes live. I saw him again today and asked him to change the composition for one, two shots. I explained to him that many people did not like his muddy hole. He refused.--Mbz1 01:21, 24 July 2007 (UTC)Mbz1[reply]
  •  Comment Now I'd like to be as serious as I could be after reading some of your comments. It is a very rare action picture of a very common but very difficult subject. The thing that the subject is common makes the picture even more interesting and valuable. Guidelines for nominators clearly specify that A bad picture of a very difficult subject is a better picture than a good picture of an ordinary subject. Have you read this, Gorgo? Any troubles with understanding what it means? The nominated picture is not bad at all. It shows a Crayfish in his natural environment, working on his burrow. I could agree with comments about focus, about lighting, but I would never agree with comments about the composition. Maybe somebody will teach me (and I am very serious about that) what should have I done to improve the composition? Do not take the picture at all? Do not nominate it on FP? Should I have taken the subject out of his hole or maybe give him a bath before taking the picture? Any other ideas? Please do share them with me. I really like to learn for the next time. I also like to show you few more pictures that I hope will help you to understand how difficult that subject was. At each of the picture you could see only some part of the subject. Please note, most of the time I was able to see nothing, but an empty hole.

Do you like the composition any better Gorgo? Am I serious enough for you, Gorgo? I really hope I am because now I'd like to let you know that I will continue to nominate as many pictures as I want to nominate because I'm really enjoying reading your funny (being very polite here) comments, but mostly because some people do like my pictures. I also like to ask next opposers: If you could, please avoid the word "composition" in the count of the problems. Trust me, your "oppose" would be much more interesting to read, if you could come up with something new and original, like, for example Karelj did: "Some organic matter in a hole. Why candidate for FP?" So far it is the sole winner for that nomination. Mbz1 04:39, 24 July 2007 (UTC)Mbz1[reply]

  •  Comment I want to add something to my upper statement. I really think that this is a very helpful picture. It is a great picture for the crayfish articles in the wikipedia. The composition is for sure not awful...and I think it is not OK to say things like that here. The picture is just not good enough for FP in my opinion. --AngMoKio 06:57, 24 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
  • I'm sorry that I don't come up with a detailed essay on why I don't think this picture is one of the best pictures on commons, but you sure don't help with flooding this page with dozens of "fun"-pictures. I'm also sorry if "awfull composition" might have sounded too derogative. When I mean "composition" I also mean the artistical value of the whole image itself not simply the arangement. My point is: this image is a mud covered clayfish in a mud-hole, you barely see the crayfish itself and lighting is also quite unfortunate, you can't be serious about this image being "one of the finest on Commons" (definition from COM:FP). A picture might not be one of the best on commons and still be good and valuable for illustrating an article on wikipedia, there is nothing wrong with that. -- Gorgo 09:22, 24 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
    • There's nothing to be sorry you said "awfull composition". I do not consider any pictures that I nominated to be a fun-picture. The thing is that for me nominating pictures for fun is my way of surviving some comments. It is what I ment, when I said I nominate the pictures for fun. Maybe it is because of my brocken English I could not express what I meant properly. I am very serious in believing that this picture is "one of the finest on Commons" with great encyclopedic value. I agree the picture has problem wih lighting. I did not want to use the flash to scare him away. For me, the value of the image would have been lost, if that crayfish was out of his mud-hole. You see, you cannot imagine how I could be serious in nominating such a picture while I cannot imagine how one could be serious in complaining about the composition or the mud. I hope you will agree that everybody could have their own opinion.I'm still waiting for your advice how to improve the composition.--Mbz1 12:02, 24 July 2007 (UTC)Mbz1[reply]
What I would do to improve it is brush away or get rid of some of the grass (assuming he won't break your finger off), and get a bit closer to the hole. I would then crop it so that there is no grass in the way of the picture. --Digon3 talk 00:25, 25 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you, Digon3. I'm afraid I could have not used your advices for a few reasons. The grass is their camouflage. Few days ago I myself saw Red-shouldered Hawk taking a crayfish out of the pond. The picture is not sharp. Everything happened so fast, but I hope you still could see a crayfish in hawk's talons and the stream of water pouring down. So my first reason for not removing the grass was not to expose my subject to predators. My second reason for not removing the grass was not to destroy the burrow. It has more complex structure than you are able to see at the picture and I'm not sure how it holds all together. Some grass roots are inside the burrow. My third reason for not removing the grass was not to scare my subject away. He is very sensitive to any movement around the burrow. The last 2 reasons also explain why I did not want to get any closer than I've already been. By the way it is what makes my subject difficult. The last reason why I did not remove the grass and did not do a bigger crop is that my idea was to show a crayfish in his natural environment. In my opinion it brings the encyclopedic value of the picture up. Thank you again for taking your time and sharing your thoughts with me.--Mbz1 01:53, 25 July 2007 (UTC)Mbz1[reply]
  •  Oppose It's hard to tell what the picture really depicts. --Derbeth talk 08:59, 25 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
    • It "depicts" grass, the mud hole and a crayfish inside.--Mbz1 13:28, 25 July 2007 (UTC)Mbz1[reply]
      • Great, but it could well be nearly everything. Featured pictures should be eyecatching and be focused on something if not spectacular, than at least interesting. I fully agree with Karelj and Gorgo. Nominating such pictures as FPs is a misunderstanding of the FP initiative. --Derbeth talk 15:52, 25 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
        • Please don't worry. Forget about this pictures and all my other pictures too. Let's be friends. Please tell me something about yourself. What is your favorite movie, song, city,quotation? I for example like "My fair Lady". My favorite song is "Sunrise, Sunset" from "Fiddler on the Roof". My favorite city is San Francisco and my favorite quotation is: "There is no sin except stupidity." - Oscar Wilde--Mbz1 16:30, 25 July 2007 (UTC)Mbz1[reply]
  •  Thank you all for the comments and the votes. Some of them were really funny.
result: withdrawn => not featured. --MichaelMaggs 05:50, 26 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Retrieved from "https://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Commons:Featured_picture_candidates/Image:Burrowing_Crayfish_in_his_burrow.jpg&oldid=20757020"